Tuesday, June 9, 2009

Starting a Horse Under Saddle: Ride #1

Now that we have tacked the horse, and he has accepted the saddle, I will think about getting on.

First I bridle the horse, leaving the halter on under the bridle, making sure that it is adjusted to fit the horse properly. Like everything else, I make sure that the fit is correct so that the horse is comfortable. Prior to this day, I have let the horse wear the bridle when I have been lunging him for the past week. I let him learn to carry the bit comfortably his mouth.

Next, I will lift the stirrups and let them drop on the horses side and I will pat the saddles' seat, jiggle the flank cinch, grab the horn and wiggle the saddle. I will continue to do this until the horse stands still and lets me do this on both sides.

Now, I will get on.

A lot of people like to have someone on the ground as a header, to hold onto the lead just in case something happens. I personally do not use someone on the ground as I feel that they can get in the way and I will be more worried about them than what I am doing. However, if you haven't started a young horse before, I would recommend having someone help you for the first few rides. A knowledgeable header can be a great help.

Standing by the horses side, I reach forward and grab the cheek piece of the halter with my left hand. That will give me sufficient control over the horses head and keep him quiet. This also prevents me from pulling on the headstall and the bit. (I do not pull the horses head around, I just hold the cheek piece.)

I then grab the saddle horn with my right hand and place my foot in the stirrup, once it is in the stirrup I will 'hop' on my other foot a few times before standing up in the stirrup. When the horse remains quiet, I will stand up placing my full weight in the stirrup. Then I will lay over their back a few times and rub the off side before I throw my leg over. I do not lay there for very long, just long enough to let the horse feel the full weight of a rider and to be comfortable with it. I am still in a position where I can dismount quickly if needed. Once I throw my leg over and I'm seated, I will let go of the horses head and just sit there holding the reins, talking to the horse, telling them how well they are doing. Then I begin gently bumping their sides with my calves, asking them to walk forward. When they are ready, they will walk a few steps and I will praise them with my voice. When I want them to stop, I say "Whoa" without pulling on them, I do not want to interfere with them at all. This is a big enough change for them as it is.

The first day that I am on their backs, I will let the ride last as long as the horse will carry me around the round pen. With some horses, they may carry me 2 or 3 times around, and others may be willing to go longer. As long as they are happy, then I am happy.

When we are done with that first ride I will dismount on the left side and then go to the off side and get on the same way I did on the left. After I dismount on the off side we are done for the day.



I will be posting next about working with retired show horses as I have gotten a few requests about that.

69 comments:

Cut-N-Jump said...

*whistles a happy tune, while looking around*

patiently waiting for the party to start...

windingwinds said...

Wait a minute CNJ, it's not Friday! Are we celebrating "hump day"?

windingwinds said...

So tell me Mr. Rotten, do you have several saddles to fit all these greenies? Is there a saddle brand you prefer that works on many types of horses?

JohnieRotten said...

Saddles?

We have an old Simco pleasure saddle with semi quarter bars that we have used on a few. I also have my old Simco ranch cutter that has full quarter bars that fits most of them.(That Simco is 30 years old and we have been througgh alot together) And then I have my Stray Dog cutter that is the baby of the bunch and is my favorite. SHHHHHH! don't tell the other saddles, I do not want them to get a complex.

Actually, I have found that my Simco ranch cutter works on most of them and that is the saddle that I prefer to use on the greenies. The full-quarter bars fit on pretty much everything!

JohnieRotten said...

If I showed you a picture of my old Simco Cutter you would probably start laughing your ass off. I have had it forever!

If you need a new saddle I suggest looking into Stray Dog Saddles.

Most importantly, I like the saddle that fits the horse the best!

windingwinds said...

I ride English & my fav saddle is a brown forward seat that I bought at auction for $40. BUT my 13 yr old doesn't want to ride english & our western saddle has full bars, doesn't fit our lg ponies. So yes shopping for new.

JohnieRotten said...

I have never started a horse in an english saddle. I have ridden them plenty of times, but never started a horse in one!

LuvMyTBs said...

Cut N Jump,

I just about fell off my chair laughing here at work when I looked at the picture you have!! Please please explain. Is this some horse training method or team bonding exercise I'm not aware of here in the East?

fernvalley01 said...

Sounds Like a nice quiet way to start , I don't have a "header " as such , but I do like to have a spotter ( someone on site in case things get western). I rarley ask for a straight ahead walk ,I tend to give them somwhere to go and ask for a slight turn (probably cheating ,but it works for me).Wordt moment always is when I am getting that leg over the first time , I have to force myself not to rush it and just swing over smoothly and settle quietly.

horspoor said...

My favorite is my old Simco barrel saddle. We are not discussing its age, or mine. My other favorite I sold to blueheron...because I just had to have a Wintec Isabell. Yeah, brilliant. I know. I'm now shopping for a new/used Stubben Romanus. In all honesty there is no way I could have shown in that Romanus anymore. It's rough looking. Sound, but looking rough.

Cut-N-Jump said...

Funny that the Simco name keeps popping up. That old pleasure saddle of ours is easier on my rickety knees than the English saddles at times. Go figure.

HP- I rode in my friends Wintec A/P once. Rubbed a giant raw spot on my leg. I am not a fan since.

As far as the English saddles- my Crosby C/C and Tony Slater dressage saddles are IT. Comfy and still plenty of life in them after all these years. I have yet to put either on Pal.

The avitar pic is a new species of caterpillar. They are attracted to moderate to high levels of alcohol and found primarily only in college dorm rooms. So far, no cocoons have been found. It is still a mystery whether or not these caterpillars transform into butterflies or moths?

horspoor said...

My friend Shirley sent that to me a while back. Just cracked me up.

Cut-N-Jump said...

HP- my best friend sent it to me and I instantly knew where it needed to go.

horspoor said...

LOL...I never think of these things.

Hey, wanna look at a couple arabs? beginner prospects...see what you think?

windingwinds said...

Well don't start many here, but if I do, it's the english. Made a mistake of climbing on redheaded pony, pony reared up, horn met my stomach, next thing I am on ground gasping for air, header is staring at me, and pony is other side of pasture.

JohnieRotten said...

I understand about the horn. I had a 8 year old show horse that I took in train in the late 80's that flipped over on me and I ended up taking the horn to the chest. Hurt like he'll for a while and I had a Circle Y imprint on my chest for about a month afterwards. To this day I hate those silver horncaps.

SFTS said...

I do prefer to use a header and have for 30 years now when getting on for the first time. A good header is worth their weight in gold! But it has to be someone you trust implicitly and who knows EXACTLY what you're thinking, as well as who understands precisely what to do. :)

Saddles........I love my Circle Y's. For English saddles, Arabian Saddle Company or Crosby. My Crosby's have lasted FOREVER. I've also got a custom made flat saddle from England that I paid $1000 for in the early 80's, it still looks like new. And I bought a Sandringham Dressage saddle from England when they were on close out at Broken Horn about ten years ago. Bar none, one of the most comfortable saddles I have ever ridden in!

windingwinds said...

Well that was a few years ago. I no longer use a header and a good first 30 days trainer is my best friend LOL. Personally I'll wear breeches any day but can't talk my 13 and 9 yr old boys into it. I used to have a ancient Circle Y, wish I didn't sell it!

JohnieRotten said...

SFTS said...
I do prefer to use a header and have for 30 years now when getting on for the first time. A good header is worth their weight in gold! But it has to be someone you trust implicitly and who knows EXACTLY what you're thinking, as well as who understands precisely what to do. :)
_______________________

If and when I do use a header, like you, it has to be someone I trust. What that header has to unserstand, is that when I am the one sitting on that horse, they(the header)is for the most part incharge. So they need to be able to read the horse as well as I can. They hold the lead rope so they better no what is going on and focus on whats going on with the horse.

That is why I do not usually use headers,but if I have to, CNJ has worked around me enough to know what I expect.

But, I did learn how to start colts when I was 11 and the guy that taught me was an old cowboy and so I learned to do it the way he did. I have done it that way for so long, having a header isa luxury!

I still cringe when I see a Circle Y saddle, especially with a horn cap!

JohnieRotten said...

I meant "better know what is going on" not " better no what is going on"

Shit, I can't spell today. WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!

CharlesCityCat said...

I have never started a horse and doubtfully ever will, but that sounds like the way I would want to do it. Slow and easy.

I have 2 close contact saddles. One is a Hartley that I have had for almost 20 years. It is in great shape and very comfortable for me. The other is a Prix de Nations that I got a real good deal on about 5 years ago and it is really comfy as well. Whinnie likes the Hartley and Wizard likes the Prix. Buck doesn't think he should be ridden at all so he hates both of them. LOL!

LuvMyTBs said...

This old English riding Gal LOVES her Circle Y. I start everybody in that and have for over 30 yrs. I feel so safe and secure in that comfy deep seat. I also have 2 Stuebbens that I have had forever and they still look almost new. We pony all the newbies and nutbucket OTTBs in full tack before we ever get on them. They hit the trails ponied by a steady Eddie takes no crap lead horse. When we do get on them it is a fairly easy process.
I'm also a huge believer in long lining/driving behind on the ground.

JohnieRotten said...

LuvMyTBs said:
I'm also a huge believer in long lining/driving behind on the ground.
______________________-

I do long line horses after I start them. There again, that is my preference. The reason that I wait, is that, I have started horses that have been longlined by my assistant trainers prior to my getting on them. And they were taught by the other trainers that they have worked for, to teach the horse to back in the longlines. Not always a god move before you get the first few rides in. If for some reason when I get on that horse and have to take hold of him, I do not want that horse to start backing as soon as he feels some contact.

The goal for me and the young horse the first day is forward movement. Not lateral movement, verticle movement or backwards movement,but rather forward movement only!

JohnieRotten said...

I will admit that I should have been paying more attention to what I my assistant trainers were doing.

But one of them told me once that she was taught to back them to soften the horse in the face. And that is a big no no in my book!

Cut-N-Jump said...

A good header can be priceless when it comes to dealing with horses for anything.

Having groomed a number of years at several barns under various trainers- being on both sides of the header position- you are a very important key in the process.

A good header can read your mind, read the horse and will keep everything as quiet and low key as possible. They the groom safe and the whole thing from going wrong.

Standing on a bucket clipping the ears of a showhorse is not the safest thing in the world- even when the horse is twitched and tranq'ed. This horse was always a winner, but you had to clip his ears and he HATED it! A good header will deal with the horse and let you focus on doing a good job. They can see when the horse needs a break and will let you know. You can give the horse a break and resume again keeping everything under control.

A good header for vet work is invaluable too. Pain and fear cannot be controled by tranquilizers. Suturing a horse, cleaning out a wound or injecting joints, requires their full attention. The vet shouldn't have to question their safety while working on a horse, but sometimes they have no choice. I have seen tech's and assistants without an ounce of a clue.

Cut-N-Jump said...

They the groom safe

Should be

They keep the other person safe...

schammieschammie said...

Love your blog, JR!

I am still trying to picture getting up in the saddle while still holding the cheekpiece of the halter... your arms and legs must be a LOT longer than mine!

My western saddle is a Dakota and it's fab. Comfortable and sound.

I'm going to start my filly in my English a/p, but once the serious riding starts outside of the round pen, we will transition to the Dakota and train in both. I have caught my bra in the saddlehorn WAY too many times to risk it on a greenie. (Being large busted AND short-waisted, (wait, NO-waisted, just hips, then boobs) isn't real conducive to saddle horns)

JohnieRotten said...

schammieschammie said...
Love your blog, JR!

I am still trying to picture getting up in the saddle while still holding the cheekpiece of the halter... your arms and legs must be a LOT longer than mine!
___________________

First of all Thanks!

Second. When I was born my mother and father said my knuckles dragged the ground.

Actually, grabbing their heads is easier that it sounds. But, again, I am used to doing it that way!

Cut-N-Jump said...

schammieschammie- The trick is not pulling on the horses head or the saddle horn when getting on. You don't want to 'drag' their head down or pull the saddle off kilter.

I'm not blessed with long arms or much distance in the waist area either. I can relate to much of what you said, with the exception of a bra hooking on the saddle horn. I hope not to experience that...

Dena said...

Tack? I love tack! I especially love good tack.
Which doesn't always mean really expensive tack.

I checked out those Stray Dogs off your link. Good looking saddles.
I like the idea of one price.

When it comes to cutting saddles I want a Leddy. Love the fit.
I train in a Tristan. I start them in a Potts roper.
English I have a Bona Allen.
And a Monarch combination(very inexpensive).

I love bridles. Probably my favorite piece of tack.

Simco did and does make some damn comfortable saddles. That last, and last, and last...

horspoor said...

Funny thing about the Simco I have...I got it because I needed something 'right now' and it was cheap. Who knew? lol

JohnieRotten said...

Dena

I rode a Leddy once when I was training horses in Texas in the early 90s. I liked it but they were way to expensive for me!

I tried a Sean Ryon that someone else owned and preferred the Leddy.

My Stray Dog is just a real nice saddle for the money!
____________________

HP

The thing about the old Sincos, is you can beat the hell out of them and they just hold up!

cattypex said...

I LURVS my old Blue Ribbon close contact AP saddle. It's about 25 yrs old now, but still looks great.

They made VERY nice, reasonably priced saddles. Each one had a little plate under the skirt with the name of the person who made it. I miss 'em.

I don't know if I'll ever have the intestinal fortitude to start my own horse.... but if I ever need a horse started, I will be asking all y'all for recommendations.

JohnieRotten said...

CP

It is not for everyone. I had a trainer/client in the 90s that did not want to start them so he sent them to me to put the first 30 days on them. He was getting older and I could understand how he felt.

Cut-N-Jump said...

HP-Hey, wanna look at a couple arabs? beginner prospects...see what you think?


Sorry I forgot to address this earlier. Sure- send or post them.

As much as JR can't stand the Arabian horse 'people', the stallion is a keeper as he is just happy here and we will likely always have at least one half arab in the barn.

Cut-N-Jump said...

HP- my old Simco was offered to me for my daughter! I put it on the mare once, it seemed to fit. Put it on her again and decided to buy it.

They were asking $150. It was missing the latigo, cinch and off side billet, as well as sporting some damn fugly wood/alum stirrups, so I countered with $125 CASH. Bought the 'missing parts', replaced the stirrups and for a whopping total of under $300 had myself a semi new saddle that was already broken in.

I despise breaking in new saddles. My knees just can't take it.

horspoor said...

I sold my Bob's to a student for $1200. Basically brand new...was killing my knees.

okay, they are both on dreamhorse. Still haven't figured out the clicky thing.

http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1404607

http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1402308

and this last one isn't an Arab..but pretty cute...and with a nickname of 'the couch' it's a possible.

http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1406937

Cut-N-Jump said...

To make the clicky links-

<+a href="web address goes here">these words will be clicky link<+/a+>

Remove the + symbols.

The first horse- they think he's a prospect after all these years? I kinda wonder sometimes, not that it can't be done, but it raises the question- Why haven't they shown him? I like his breeding.

The second horse is cute and has youth on his side. If he is being ridden and shown by a 13 y/o he would be a strong option. Egyptian?

The Couch- we have a bay mare like that. I love her! She's the horse we leased out for 4H. He seems well put together- the only thing I see in the photo is the left front looks like it is pointing inwards a bit. May be the way he is stood up? But worth a look see.

Cut-N-Jump said...

I forgot to add- confo shots. I know, you know, to ask for confo shots...

Dena said...

JR 2 Grand ain't beans it is a fair amount of money.

A really affordable line of quality made saddles is Blue River.
It just doesn't have enough angle on the tree for me to be in love.
And smooth seat doesn't serve me well.

The Leddys always show up when I don't necessarily have the ready for that.
The last one was $2200.
Made me want to cry. It was X-Mas.
But I couldn't tell the kids look what you got me and still live with myself.lol

Cut-N-Jump said...

Dena- we went back and forth on smooth leather vs. roughout. Padded seat / not padded.

The roughout leather + batwing chaps = you aren't going to move, even if you want to. You better be sitting where you want to when the action starts.

The smooth leather, you can move around as needed. Of course you can also wind up in the dirt with a quick enough horse scooting out from under you.

I prefer the padding as I get older. My butt has enough, never in the right place to be effective.

As with all tack and horse equipment- it is an investment. In making sure the horses back isn't sore, it fits you right and well cared for, if need be- you can sell it to cover other financial crisis' in your life.

Dena said...

CNJ uh huh. I agree. I prefer the look of the smooth.
Just ain't trying to ride a cutter in it.
Dirt scares me.
And I totally agree on the resale thing.
You pay too dear and you know you will never see it again.
I like the name of the brand. Stray Dog. I also like Pinkston by Double JJ.
Poverty bites.lol

SFTS said...

CharlesCityCat wrote:
I have 2 close contact saddles. One is a Hartley that I have had for almost 20 years. It is in great shape and very comfortable for me. The other is a Prix de Nations that I got a real good deal on about 5 years ago and it is really comfy as well. Whinnie likes the Hartley and Wizard likes the Prix. Buck doesn't think he should be ridden at all so he hates both of them. LOL!
- - - - - - - -

I still have my old Prix de Nations that I bought in 1982. Remember when the "close contact" had NO knee rolls at all? I love teaching students to ride Hunters in that saddle. After starting out with a Borelli as a little kid (blech), I started jumping in my old Prix. What a rush!!

SFTS said...

LuvMyTBs wrote:
This old English riding Gal LOVES her Circle Y. I start everybody in that and have for over 30 yrs. I feel so safe and secure in that comfy deep seat. I also have 2 Stuebbens that I have had forever and they still look almost new. We pony all the newbies and nutbucket OTTBs in full tack before we ever get on them. They hit the trails ponied by a steady Eddie takes no crap lead horse.

When we do get on them it is a fairly easy process.

I'm also a huge believer in long lining/driving behind on the ground.

- - - - - - - -

Ponying is wonderful! I also do a great deal of longlining before ever getting on them. I want them to know so much more than the very basics by the time I climb aboard.

I'd love to have a couple of nice Stubbens, one Dressage, one Hunt seat.

But give me one of my Circle Y's any day of the week. I start and school all my horses in a Western saddle, always have.

And yes JR, both of them have silver saddle horn caps. LOL

SFTS said...

JohnieRotten wrote:
I do long line horses after I start them. There again, that is my preference. The reason that I wait, is that, I have started horses that have been longlined by my assistant trainers prior to my getting on them. And they were taught by the other trainers that they have worked for, to teach the horse to back in the longlines. Not always a god move before you get the first few rides in. If for some reason when I get on that horse and have to take hold of him, I do not want that horse to start backing as soon as he feels some contact.

The goal for me and the young horse the first day is forward movement. Not lateral movement, verticle movement or backwards movement,but rather forward movement only!

- - - - - - - -

I don't like to teach them to back in longlines until I've been on them for a while. But then I do want them to learn to back from the ground. We can graduate to them learning to back when I'm on them, from there.

Interesting, not ground driving until after you get on. You're more of the old time cowboy type to start horses. Me, I want 'em practically doing the ballet before I get on. LOL!

JohnieRotten wrote:
I will admit that I should have been paying more attention to what I my assistant trainers were doing.

But one of them told me once that she was taught to back them to soften the horse in the face. And that is a big no no in my book!

- - - - - - - -

I've never allowed one of my assistants to longline for me. About the most they'll do is bit & longe a horse, with strict guidelines. They groom, they tack, they longe, they help in a variety of ways. But my clients are paying me for training their horses. Not an assistant.

One thing that bugs the Hell out of me are those trainers who have assistants who ride 99% of the horses in the barn. Trainer takes WAY too many horses for one person to reasonably ride in a day. They only ride their favorites, or the ones they feel are going to have the best shot at winning in the show pen. The rest get ridden by assistant trainers or "helpers". Not saying that's what you do. But it's a peeve of mine.

SFTS said...

Cut-N-Jump wrote:
A good header can be priceless when it comes to dealing with horses for anything.

Having groomed a number of years at several barns under various trainers- being on both sides of the header position- you are a very important key in the process.

A good header can read your mind, read the horse and will keep everything as quiet and low key as possible. They the groom safe and the whole thing from going wrong.

Standing on a bucket clipping the ears of a showhorse is not the safest thing in the world- even when the horse is twitched and tranq'ed. This horse was always a winner, but you had to clip his ears and he HATED it! A good header will deal with the horse and let you focus on doing a good job. They can see when the horse needs a break and will let you know. You can give the horse a break and resume again keeping everything under control.

A good header for vet work is invaluable too. Pain and fear cannot be controled by tranquilizers. Suturing a horse, cleaning out a wound or injecting joints, requires their full attention. The vet shouldn't have to question their safety while working on a horse, but sometimes they have no choice. I have seen tech's and assistants without an ounce of a clue.

- - - - - - - -

Agreed 100% ~ bears repeating. :)

JohnieRotten said...

SFTS said:

"Interesting, not ground driving until after you get on. You're more of the old time cowboy type to start horses. Me, I want 'em practically doing the ballet before I get on. LOL!
___________________

Yes I do start 'em and train 'em old school. If there is one thing I absolutely hate, it is a horse that is too soft and rubber necked before I get them to go forward with me on their backs.

I want that little bit resistance in their face so I can soften them while I am on their backs. That way I can add leg aids at the same time. Not the other way around.

I also hate to see people put martigales on them when they start them. That restricts the young horse way too much.

There is an Arab trainer that lives a few miles down the road from us. He puts draw reins on a horse when he starts them so they won't buck.

The last time I talked to him was about 3 years ago, and the topic of draw reins on his youngsters came up. I told him that if he was afraid of them bucking, then let a real horseman start them and he can take over when they have 30 days on them. I had known this guy for years, and now he no longer talks to me.

I do not know everything, but I do know how to do my job and I am not afraid to do it. I know the risks and I know how to use "Common Sense"

If it does not feel right, look right or sound right, chances are it is not right.

Sorry about the soap box.

horspoor said...

The drawreins so they dont buck is pretty stupid. If the horse has any athletic ability at all...that isn't going to stop bucking...if anything it's going to encourage up and over. As the youngster feels trapped.

Snaffle, loose reins, ride light in the saddle...go forward. That's it for the first few rides. I'll guide them a little...but mainly it's just go.

A hundred years ago I used to ride for a name working cow/cutting trainer. He'd have me ride the young ones. It was just go. Pick a spot on the horizon, and just ride toward it. When I first started riding for him I asked if he wanted me to 'do anything'. Nope...leave them alone, just ride them straight, and forward. After an hour of just toodling along, I'd bring them back. He'd school on them for a bit, I'd take them back, cool them out, hose them off, and put them up. Over time...the long walks became shorter, and the schooling became longer.

I think 'The Couch' is probably the best option. Although, I do really like the chestnut Egyptian gelding. Confo shots for sure.

horspoor said...

Okay, so who do we think the moron is that posted as Fugs on FWOTD?

JohnieRotten said...

HP

Apparently according to several people it is BHM

JohnieRotten said...

Ya the draw reins on the youngster just astounded me the first time I saw him do it!

horspoor said...

Nope, don't think it was bhm. Actually damn near positive it wasn't. Not at all her style.

JohnieRotten said...

BUM did not do the original post.

The problem is, I am lost in all this. I do not know what is going on, I am just going byvwhat I am told.

horspoor said...

I just got in. And saw people talking about it, so went to look at the post. Pretty weird.

See, if you were going to post as fugly...you'd want to use a name other than fugs...and use her style of writing. lol...okay you wanna be trolls...that's how its done ya morons.

horspoor said...

Tell you what, this looking for a suitable horse for a beginner with health issues is no fun, and not easy.

JohnieRotten said...

HP

Like I said. I try to stay out it.

Let me know what kind of horse you want and I will as what I can find.

horspoor said...

You're probably smart. Stay out of it, it all passes. And is just the internet after all.

I'm looking for a smallish kids horse. Forgiving, seasoned, and safe. Little girl is 10. Body smart, athletic, reads everything horse related she can get her hands on, and really wants to do well, she listens.

She however has a condition that makes her bones soft. It's not a guaranteed break if she comes off, but it is worrisome.

The parents don't want to tell people this bit of informtion. Makes it kind of tough.

JohnieRotten said...

I will keep my eyes open. Any specific age for the horse?

horspoor said...

Not young, and not on death's door. lol

SFTS said...

JohnieRotten wrote:
Yes I do start 'em and train 'em old school. If there is one thing I absolutely hate, it is a horse that is too soft and rubber necked before I get them to go forward with me on their backs.

I want that little bit resistance in their face so I can soften them while I am on their backs. That way I can add leg aids at the same time. Not the other way around.

I also hate to see people put martigales on them when they start them. That restricts the young horse way too much.

There is an Arab trainer that lives a few miles down the road from us. He puts draw reins on a horse when he starts them so they won't buck.

The last time I talked to him was about 3 years ago, and the topic of draw reins on his youngsters came up. I told him that if he was afraid of them bucking, then let a real horseman start them and he can take over when they have 30 days on them. I had known this guy for years, and now he no longer talks to me.

I do not know everything, but I do know how to do my job and I am not afraid to do it. I know the risks and I know how to use "Common Sense"

If it does not feel right, look right or sound right, chances are it is not right.

Sorry about the soap box.

- - - - - - - -

I don't mind a horse being "too soft", I'd rather they know what to do with their heads before I get on. Inevitably, they will still revert back to resisting once you get on their backs. Just a different approach, that's all. What works for one does not necessarily work for another. Neither is wrong. :)

Likewise, I ALWAYS use martingales on my young horses, from the third or fourth time being bitted and longed, through getting on them for the first time and so on. I do not want that horse to be able to crack me in the face with his head. Hence, the martingale as a safety feature. Loosely, not too restrictive. But effective if engaged.

Draw reins to prevent bucking? How utterly ridiculous. I do use draw reins. NOT on my horses just getting started, and never to prevent bad behavior. Always in conjunction with a direct rein (which is the rein I ride with ~ draw rein is only there to be a "reminder" if I need it). I had some clients last year who bought a nice Arabian mare from some friends in Bakersfield. They were told to always ride the mare in draw reins, because that was the "emergency brake". WTF??

horspoor said...

They are in the $3500 or so range. Makes it a tad tougher.

SFTS said...

horspoor wrote:
The drawreins so they dont buck is pretty stupid. If the horse has any athletic ability at all...that isn't going to stop bucking...if anything it's going to encourage up and over. As the youngster feels trapped.

Snaffle, loose reins, ride light in the saddle...go forward. That's it for the first few rides. I'll guide them a little...but mainly it's just go.

A hundred years ago I used to ride for a name working cow/cutting trainer. He'd have me ride the young ones. It was just go. Pick a spot on the horizon, and just ride toward it. When I first started riding for him I asked if he wanted me to 'do anything'. Nope...leave them alone, just ride them straight, and forward. After an hour of just toodling along, I'd bring them back. He'd school on them for a bit, I'd take them back, cool them out, hose them off, and put them up. Over time...the long walks became shorter, and the schooling became longer.

- - - - - - - -

That's it. "Just go". If they don't understand forward, you've got a problem. A BIG problem. Which usually leads to up. And I HATE rearing.

JohnieRotten said...

HP

I will look tomorrow. I am off to bed. Good night y'all

horspoor said...

Hey, this is a cutie. Do you really think he makes 15h?

http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1365993&share_this=Y

horspoor said...

Thanks JR. Night. Today was last day of school for son. woohoo..for him, not for me. lol

cattypex said...

"The parents don't want to tell people this bit of informtion. Makes it kind of tough."

Heh... when I was a kid my Crohn's was REALLY bad, but a wise therapist told my parents - and me - that I wasn't a Sick Person, but just a Person with some stuff to work around. It really helped the whole family.

Sounds like maybe these parents are taking that approach?

That little huntseat Arab is SO CUTE.

I guess it all depends on what the little girl really wants to do, and what she's secretly dreaming.

; )

horspoor said...

That's very true Cattypex. I hadn't thought of it that. I don't want her treated like some invalid. She's terribly cute kid. Quiet, but very bright. Hard to read at first. Starting to get glimpes of her real personality.

One of my old students was there. She lives out of town now, but her horse is still at the stable with her grandmother. The kid and the horse have won state championships, Top fived at nationals, and been invited to the World. Good horse, good kid.

Horse has been off for awhile due to some quarter cracks (which kept her from going to the World of course, perfect timing right). So, I have the new little girl in the roundpen. Old student asks if the kid wants to try her horse. I ask the kid if she'd like to ride him. She says, "I'm all about that. Yeah, I'm on it." Just cracked me up.

So my old student comes into the round pen with her horse. Rides him around. Lets the little girl see where his gears are etc. Somehow Stacy Westphal comes up in the conversation, the little girl mentions her. Rach...of course goes..oh you mean bridless, like this? Reaches up, pulls the bridle, hangs it on the horn and proceeds to put the horse through his paces. Spins, canter, backs up etc... The little girl is now totally in awe. And wants on now. I tell ex-student to put the bridle back on...oh yeah...good idea. lol Then of course has to stand on the horse for the kid. UGH...don't teach her stupid horse/human tricks yet. lol They had a blast though.

Cut-N-Jump said...

HP- so are they leaning towards any specific breeds? Discipline?

I found it funny that bhm copied and pasted the post, then was so suprised that Wild Caballo pointed out you can have more than one screen name. I mean, bhm also posts as Fact from time to time on FHoTD. Then she (bhm) came back saying oh, yeah. I forgot we covered that here...

I mean, come on people.

Sheesh.

Laughing from the sidelines....

horspoor said...

I thought bhm posted it to show someone was posting as fugly. I may have missed the point...I often do. lol

I'm not leaning toward any specific breed. I really need something kid friendly, and not overly large. Although, the kid had a blast on Thomas, who is probably 15.3h. But Thomas has been there, done that, had a little girl grow up on him.

They would like to show around the rail I think. Of course are enamored of paints, pals, and any other kool kolor. lol